Kahn Attacked

[Messiah]

How does this sound for a response?

"We are in violation of none of the conditions of our treaties or agreements. If you are a party to any agreements or treaties concerning us, you have violated the terms therein with your unwarranted and unprovoked attack upon a member of our alliance. Your violation of those terms negates our obligations in respect to you. If you are not a party to agreement concerning us, we are under no obligation regarding your aggression. No treaty or agreement to which we are party prohibits us from defending ourselves against aggression. Our armament is a direct response to your aggression. Our retaliation is a direct response to your aggression. We are happy to withdraw as soon as you are willing to discuss terms for a cessation of the hostilities you have initiated."

Comments?

[Isileth]

Sounds good to me, makes it clear we are well in our rights to attack him.

[Messiah]

I've updated Raasaa and NV.

[Inquisitor]

Very diplomatic

[Messiah]

The proposed message has been sent to Travian verbatim. Isileth, give him a round in the morning. We'll give him 6 hours to respond, then I'll attack. Another 6, then Seher. All we want from him, I think, is to change his attitude and sue for peace. We'll take more out of him than he took out of Kahn, I suspect. Maybe for terms we should ask for an apology an a promise not to rearm for a certain number of weeks.

Thoughts? Suggestions?

[Isileth]

I think its fair to say we wont be getting anything out of him so I think a way to make sure he doesn't try to get revenge would be best.

Certainly another few hits might be deserved

As long as its made very clear that attacking us is not going to be accepted I think our work will be done.

[Isileth]

Ok ive attacked him again.

Ill leave it up to you Messiah if you want to send him some form of ultimatum before you unleash your force upon him.

[Inquisitor]

He's already declared peace hasn't he, if you destroy his ability to pay reparations, he's not left with any incentive to take the ultimatum.

Food for thought

[Messiah]

He replied.

To: SSX Messiah From: lawrence119 Date: 9/25/2008 1:19:52 AM

Subject: RE: Terms for Cessation of Hostilities


Message: What the hell is the point in attacking a Nation that is in Anarchy before you attack??? You know perfectly well beacuse i'm in Anarchy i can't attack or send anything back to your alliance's nation, i gave it up, it was against nearly two weeks ago.
It's a ridicule to call me aggressive when three big nations of an alliance are making an extremely late revenge attack on a nation that had previously been Wipe out, its so stupid it's almost funny!

And so did I.

To: lawrence119 From: SSX Messiah Date: 9/25/2008 7:38:21 AM

Subject: RE: Terms for Cessation of Hostilities


Message: You have been attacked in retaliation for your unwarranted aggression against a member of our alliance. You will continue to be attacked until such a time as you contact us with a request for peace. We will cease hostilities as soon as you are willing to enter into a negotiations for the terms of peace.

We regret that it is only through the use of force that you may come to reconsider your past aggression against your neighbors. You have employed the languages of force and aggression in the relationship with those peaceful nations upon whom you preyed. We are replying in the language of your choice.

Once again, hostilities against your nation will cease the moment you make an honest request for peace. Negotiations can then begin without the threat of further harm. The next step is in your hands.

[Messiah]

He is at peace with Kahn. If kahn has been away, then I assume peace was automatically declared after so many days of his inactivity. Not sure if that is a game mechanic or not, but I am pretty sure kahn has to make an active decision to request or approve peace.


This guy attacked 3 other nations because he was bored. He has caused a nation strength loss of at least 1600 points in those upon whom he preyed. He is not a nice guy, and he doesn't really want to accept the consequences of his actions. I think I've been very clear in my expectations. He has so far only made threats and excuses. All he has to do is ask for peace.

I am willing to settle for an apology and monitoring of his nation's status. Maybe an infrastructure cap for a while. I think it is very reasonable, and it will allow our members to grow ebnough before he decides he want revenge.

Am I being unreasonable? (honest question, not sarcasm)

[Messiah]

I suggest we hold further attacks for a while today. We need to make sure he has a chance to read the last message and respond.

[Inquisitor]

I dunno if thats reasonable honestly.

Whats his nation link?

[W11chter]

I will send him a message from me, as an individual not as an allied defender, letting him know that I am awaiting his response to the ultimatum. I did attack him this morning, though, before Messiah's message was sent, because he had increased his troop size to over three thousand soldiers and as many tanks as can be had at that size. Keep me updated on his response.

[Messiah]

Travian replied to my last message.

To: SSX Messiah From: lawrence119 Date: 9/25/2008 10:33:23 AM

Subject: RE: Terms for Cessation of Hostilities


Message: Your a moron, have you not listen to what i have said or are you intentionally attacking me to wind me up,,, Who's the agressor now!!!!!!

And my reply.

I will speak plainly.

You attacked our friend without provocation. We are defending him and punishing the aggression. We will cease all attacks as soon as you request peace. You started this, you can finish it. Ask for peace, and we will be happy to discuss terms.

If you have nothing but insults and complaints, you will not have peace. If you want peace, YOU MUST ASK FOR IT.

I hope that is clear. You started this, you can finish it.

Thoughts?

[W11chter]

I don't really enjoy picking on him. I told him I would hold off until the 27th to let him sue for peace, but he only made it clear that he was not interested in asking for it. He told me to keep attacking but to pull off my pretenses.

I'm not really enjoying running him into the ground, though. I think the suit for reparations is not going to get through to him at all; when will we be able to say that the debt is paid if the repayment must come from war?

[Isileth]

Yeah I would rather not keep attacking him. But I also think we need to make sure he isn't going to attack our alliance again in revenge.

It may be that a simple warning that if he attacks again we wont stop next time will work.

[Kon]

A little over 7 hours ago I shot off this message to our buddy. I think I went pretty easy on him, all things considered. He has yet to open the message, so we shall see how he reacts.

Hello, Lawrence. You have been attacked by my alliance mates because you attacked me. Since I can't say I particularly play this game for the purpose of building my nation, I will agree to let you go if only you would pay 250k. This is far, far less than the damage you inflicted on my nation, and is easy enough for a nation your size to pay back.

In the future, please refrain from attacking aligned nations. When aligned nations are attacked, their entire alliance will retaliate. This is the purpose of an alliance. If you want to raid, raid None nations.

Thank you.

[Messiah]

At 11 last night, I launched two cruise missile attacks at him, just to get his attention. Damage was minimal. He asked for peace at 12:20. Three hours later, he sent messages of defiance, inviting us to destroy him, rearmed and attacked me. Someone nailed him pretty good recently. I am assuming it was Isileth or Seher.

He has 100 inf, 3500 soldiers, and 200 tanks left. Not much of him left, really. I imagine he will keep attacking. What do we want to do? Retaliate every time he attacks? ZI him and leave him be? The guy doesn't seem to have a lot of common sense. He doesn't seem to see the larger picture in the game. He doesn't seem to comprehend consequences. It is too bad. I had hope when I saw his request for peace.

[W11chter]

He launched a cruise missile attack at me. Could I request that you and Isileth hit him with a couple of missiles today? I have 4000 soldiers waiting to invade, but I need him to be just a little bit weaker.

[Messiah]

I asked him if he was sure he did not want peace. He hasn't responded.

Let's give him some time - see what he does.

What is your time zone, Wachter?

[Inquisitor]

I am still running at wartime troop levels from our last adventure and have been pouring my daily revenue into infrastructure so I can get to a University and make my tech deals run more smoothly.

Just FYI, sitting this one out until I have more capital to invest in the military.

[W11chter]

No worries. He can only have three attackers at once, methinks.

[Messiah]

Yeah, only three attackers. I think Zeph wanted a chance, if anyone declares peace. Of course, at this point it would look bad for us to open a slot for a new attacker.

Are we going to ZI this guy? Just keep him on the ropes? Keep him in anarchy? Kahn, you know this game better than us. What should we do now? There will be no reparations. He is bent on defiance and casting himself as the victim. I don't want to beat a dead horse, but I don't want him thinking his move attack was acceptable?

On another note, do we invite his other two victims, both unaligned, to join us?

[Inquisitor]

On another note, do we invite his other two victims, both unaligned, to join us?

Yes

[Messiah]

I asked him earlier if her was sure he did not want peace. Here is his relpy.

To: SSX Messiah From: lawrence119 Date: 9/26/2008 11:54:08 AM

Subject: RE: Peace?


Message: i did, after i made peace with your member, you could have negotiated or threatened for the money or tech i stole bk i would have gladly given it bk! but you and the other two members saw fit to be agressive and now i can't afford anything!

My reply.

We were happy to settle for your request for peace, but you took a long time coming to that point and subsequently withdrew the request. If you want peace, you may have it. I will order all attacks to stop right now. You must apply for peace with ALL parties in which you are now involved in war. That includes members of our alliance and the other nations you attacked. We will accept peace as long as you issue an apology for your attack and agree not to maintain your military at greater than 20% for a period of one month. Any future aggression against any member of our alliance will be met without restraint. If you agree to these terms, request peace. Will will abide by the terms of this peace for as long as you. Any violation will be addressed immediately.

I hope we can resolve this without any further destruction. Please remember that when you attack a member of an alliance, you attack the whole alliance.

These terms expire in 12 hours.

I hope everyone is okay with this position. I really don't want to ZI the kid. I think he knows he screwed up and he is simply too proud to admit it. He has 12 hours. Don't attack him before the time elapses. I recommend that we all message him asking him to request peace. Let us make sure that we are all very clear in offering him the chance to ask for peace. Please be clear that you will accept peace if he requests it. If we end up ZIing this guy, it has to be because he rejected every single, clearly stated request for peace.

Thoughts?