Split off from Group Website thread

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Split off from Group Website thread

PostPosted: Tue Feb 28, 2006 1:59 pm

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Stracius
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New thread so I don't hijack the other one, Inputs for our Group Website

Vegeta's post :
Prince.Vegeta wrote:alright, heres my 2 cents. befor i even started playing conquer Carlos told me bout the initiation from befor. and i totaly agreed with him, that definatly tested the trust factor. plus it was very hard core roleplaying, withs is what the rpg's are all about. i think the oath isnt a bad idea either. yes its kinda corny but we are playing a game here. you cant take everything too seriously but, there must be a decree of trust, respect and honour. im not sure about the website. tho i like josefs ideas about profiles for our conquer pc's, and about the whole no ranks, thing, thats all well and good but there really should be some sort of seniority level, like the older members have to be able to keep newcomers from screwing around and making us look bad, or getting our guild enemies, and such. im not sure what to suggest here but its also nice to see something other than 'guild member' next to your name once you've been with the group for a while, u know, makes u feal more important, respected, needed...etc. anyway, im blabering on about nothing now arent i?...haha. wel thats too much tyoing for now, tell me what u think of my incoherent mumbling.

alright, my 49 cents :D
and about the whole no ranks, thing, thats all well and good but there really should be some sort of seniority level, like the older members have to be able to keep newcomers from screwing around and making us look bad, or getting our guild enemies, and such.
A system that I liked, for the most part, was one I saw used when I played WoW. This was back with the SSC mind you, and not our current SSX divisions here. 4 main ranks that consisted of: A guild leader; guild moderators; guild members; and initiates. Everyone except the initiates were guild members (for obvious reasons :P ).

One guild leader, but only because the game mechanics required there being one to create the guild. He/She didn't serve any capacity other than as a figurehead and an ambassador. They were the person other guilds would approach formally for help, complaints, teaming up, etc. Members could approach the guild leader as a quicker method of spreading an idea or suggestion to other members for consideration. Decisions were made by general consensus of the members, and critical ones put up to vote.

Then there were the Moderators. Typically just a few, but increased as guild size increased. Their role being just to keep order and, well, moderate any bad behaviour. The only decisions they were permitted to make without consulting the whole guild were regarding small matters of discipline. i.e. whether or not a person was misbehaving, and if they needed to be warned/chastised (in private preferably). If problems didn't get resolved, then any bigger solutions were brought before the guild members. Usually kicks, bans, blacklists, or seeking other possible options to resolve the problem.

I suppose the Mods could be viewed as seniority you speak of. I don't prefer senior players only being given the position though. Only people that are level-headed and willing to put up with that much more stress. I should add as a side note, however, that this did not happen in the SSC WoW guild several times. Old SSC'rs who decided to buy/play WoW after we were well established were occasionally made Mods right upon joining. Whether or not they were qualified for the job.

This is one big reason why I dislike the idea of "seniority". It doesn't always translate to "qualified". In fact, one such person ended up causing more problems in the process (and headaches for me when I had to clean up after him). It was an ugly situation that I didn't want to participate in as it would've resulted in several broken friendships. Ultimately one of the many reasons I decided to leave the game. That and there were more ranks within the guild than I would have liked. Seven or more I think... it's been a while. Gave the feeling of "I'm more equal than you", but I digress :p
im not sure what to suggest here but its also nice to see something other than 'guild member' next to your name once you've been with the group for a while, u know, makes u feal more important, respected, needed...etc.
I really liked the "Initiates" to "Members" transition. Signifies that a person has become accepted and trusted enough to join the rest of the guild. I suppose you could replace "Guild Member" with "Respected Member", just as long as all members are ranked that, heh. Keep everyone equal, and there will be fewer problems down the road. Less opportunity for resentment OR favoritism :shake: .

Anyhow, I can only speak from my experience and make my suggestions. I've yet to come across the perfect guild system to make things run smoothly, and keep everyone happy at the same time. I've found this one to be the best that I've experience so far. Ultimately, of course, the decision remains in the hands of you fellows forming the division. Especially since I haven't played this game (yet), so am not quite sure of it's mechanics or the atmosphere.

Damn, this post turned out bigger than I thought it would. Guess I had a lot on my chest ;D . I imagine that I'm preaching to the choir for the most part, but hope this might be insightful to some newer members. Please pardon the length(/spam), and I hope the viewpoint helps.


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In the off chance anyone reads this post and objects to my observations (you know who you are), this is my attempt to "lawyer-ify" what's been said. You know, the whole trying to keep some people from taking this the wrong way, because it /always/ happens *sigh*. If you don't know who you are, it's not you. Feel free to ignore this part as it has no bearing on you whatsoever. Thank god.

I only posted what I didn't like about the guild system to give my experience. To show why attempting certain ways to run the guild might fail or cause problems. In no way, shape, or form am I attempting slander at the SSC WoW guild. Notice, for example, the lack of names being supplied. If you don't agree with what I saw, too bad. My opinion is my own damn opinion, and I call it how I see it. If you saw them differently, good for you. Feel free to *PM/IM* me to clear anything up. That being said...

Most of the mods there did a better work than could be expected for being human. Damn great, in fact. I can only hope that I was somewhat decent when I had the same job myself. I made many friends in the game and enjoyed myself immensely. For the most part, anyway :p

(wonder if I should even bother anymore...)
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 01, 2006 5:08 am

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jozef
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IMO: I don't see anything wrong with that setup. Mods for protection and not political domination seems quite beneficial.

PostPosted: Thu Mar 02, 2006 12:29 am

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LIGHTNING
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I think what Vegeta was trying to say about the different guild member status, is a game feature that needs to be implemented, not within the SSX itself. Since there are only 3 level if guild membership in the CO game: Guild Leader, Deputy Leader, and Member.

As for seniority, it doesn't hurt to listen to someone who's been with us longer. But, I do admit, I could be a bit bias sometimes in my descisions as acting "Guild Leader" sometimes. Since, Vegeta is my real life best friend and all, I value his opinion very greatly- but ofcourse, I trust he knows what's best for the SSX guild in the game, and situations and relations within the guild among us.

Though, I like whats been done in the SSX - WoW group in particular.

Let the members just join the guild. Doesn't mean they're SSX, just inniates. One proposal I can think of is, members who are active in the forums, will make it to a list of current SSX members. It'll be a smaller number of members void of inniates, and guild jumpers.

As of now, the only "Real SSX" in the game are the ones that visit, and participate in the forums. That number is 7 including myself. But in the game, we currently have 16 members (Inniates, etc)

And I still like the vouching method of inniation for membership still be implemented.
I always believed that the core of what made SSC great in the past, is here in the present and future of the SSX.
- LIGHTNING (September 22, 2005)

PostPosted: Thu Mar 02, 2006 1:48 am

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Stracius
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LIGHTNING wrote:I think what Vegeta was trying to say about the different guild member status, is a game feature that needs to be implemented, not within the SSX itself. Since there are only 3 level if guild membership in the CO game: Guild Leader, Deputy Leader, and Member.
Yeah. Like I said, I don't know the mechanics of the game. Thanks for clearing that up though. Only 3 ranks? Wouldn't have expected that... weird. Maybe good, keep things simple.

PostPosted: Sun Mar 05, 2006 8:26 am

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Prince.Vegeta
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ill start off by apologizing for my lack of activity in the forum the past week, i've working late and havent had time to log on let alone check the forum and post.

i dont see anything wrong with what you've said. your points are all very valid, and you seem to be very experienced in guilds infoved with online games. i however am not, im just a logical guy. sometimes i think about some things too much and not focus on whats important. number one, is this is a game and we're ment to have fun playing it. so if it becomes too complicated it can be frustrating and stressfull like you pointed out. but the great thing about an mmo, is that u choose your own role and play how you want to. so if u want to get deeply involved in a guild and be a big part of it it would involve some work and devotion, and those who dont enjoy that dont have to. the great thing about getting this forum is it will be easy to identify who wants to be an integral part of the guild. like Lighning said, those who are active and post here often are the same way in the server. and those who dont are simply initiates or lightly active members. a fun part of being in a guild could also be having a role, a job. some ppl like to have a purpose. some way to feal needed or useful. and as someone becomes experienced and good at his job, may find himself teaching others to help him as the guild grows. im not saying i have any idea how to impliment something like this, or that i know how well it could work. im just voicing my opinion, like you.

anyway im not arguing or disagreeing with u, simple is good. but sometimes its fun to throw a wrench in the gears just to see what happens. anyway thats my shpeal. let me know what u think, and sorry if i was kinda all over the place with my thoughts, sometimes i do that. and thanx for your confidence im my thought and opinions Lightning.
"What we do in life, echoes in eternity"

PostPosted: Sun Mar 05, 2006 9:15 am

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Stracius
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Prince.Vegeta wrote:and as someone becomes experienced and good at his job, may find himself teaching others to help him as the guild grows. im not saying i have any idea how to impliment something like this, or that i know how well it could work. im just voicing my opinion, like you.
Yeah, an excellent idea. I did a little bit of this, but only in regards to helping new players get started. I preferred to keep it an unofficial role, and helping others was one of my biggest enjoyments in the game.

However, the Bladefist WoW division are playing around with creating official "Mentor" roles if that sparks your interest. Theirs' are basically just class mentors (i.e. priest, mage, druid, etc.). Might hop over on their forums to see how that's going. Help give an idea as to how to implement your own system, whether or not it ends up being similar.

Wrench in the gears, huh? :lol: Well just as long as it doesn't completely break the machine, I suppose :sweat: . G'luck

PostPosted: Sun Mar 12, 2006 9:37 am

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Prince.Vegeta
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Wrench in the gears, huh? Well just as long as it doesn't completely break the machine, I suppose .
sry, bad analogy, i just meant a little complication can be a good thing, everything doesnt have to be super simple.
"What we do in life, echoes in eternity"

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